Ed Burke
Member
Healthy living is fine, but it's having fun that keeps us going!
Posts: 433
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Post by Ed Burke on Sept 3, 2011 22:44:53 GMT -5
As Paul van den Berg has found (screenshots) and no doubt a number of others including myself, SKOC Ocana is in a quarry when one uses addon mesh. A look at the strip in Google Earth shows the reason; MSFS have put the strip 2.5nm east of its true position. The default scenery is garbage so they got away with it, but that position is truly in the hills. The correct co-ords are N08*18'.900 W073*21'.507 where one would favour building a strip. Do we have anybody who knows how to fiddle the sim numbers so as to correct the error
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Post by Andrew Godden on Sept 3, 2011 23:55:04 GMT -5
Ed,
I have found the issue of airports in "quarries" as a result of add-on mesh scenery to be a common problem with both FS9 and FSX in South America in general. Be it from MS placing the airport at the wrong coordinates or applying the wrong airport elevation in the .bgl scenery file it is the "right royal pain".
Due to the various mesh and scenery add-ons, I can only do the event planning based on a "clean" install of FS9 and FSX.
Whilst I have never done it myself, I understand the secret is in editing the .bgl scenery files with an airport scenery editor such as AFCAD Ver 2.21 or Airport Design Editor (ADE) Ver 1.50. Both of these are freeware.
The next challenge is finding the offending .bgl scenery file in MSFS. Otherwise, you start from scratch and build a more accurate representation of the airport based on available info and data, including Google Earth for detailed positioning of taxiways, etc. (as an old surveyor, you should appreciate that side of it). Once you have completed the design, you add the scenery to MSFS in the normal manner.
I may have over-simplified it, and anyone who has done some scenery design can correct me on the detail please, but that's what I understand it involves.
Cheers Andrew
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Ed Burke
Member
Healthy living is fine, but it's having fun that keeps us going!
Posts: 433
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Post by Ed Burke on Sept 4, 2011 6:05:46 GMT -5
"Due to the various mesh and scenery add-ons, I can only do the event planning based on a "clean" install of FS9 and FSX."
Andrew I appreciate your position in planning the rally and there was certainly no criticism intended. I am interested in the general issue of correcting faults in FS when we see them. The airstrips in holes has been an ongoing problem but now that Bill has abandoned FS we are on our own and I feel that if we can improve the accuracy of the sim detail and publicise the results then we are helping all simming fans get a better product. I just don't have any idea how to go about it, Your words have raised the curtain a little, thanks.
That said, positional data from FS9 appears to be identical in FSX so maybe I was kite flying in hoping that any later addition of the MSsim would have been more accurate.
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Post by Andrew Godden on Sept 4, 2011 8:51:48 GMT -5
Ed,
I certainly understand, and Allan Lowson and I have exchanged emails on how we might be able to continue to grow Bluegrass Airlines in general. Whilst not wanting to commit to anything right now, this type of scenery issue might be an opportunity to explore.
I think I know you well enough and certainly took no criticism from your post. My comments were more for other participants who will read the Forums and may not be familiar with the challenges of creating and running an event.
I am broadly aware of freeware add-on scenery that serves to correct such anomalies and a search by airport name or ICAO code might yield a solution without having to "reinvent the wheel" in the short term.
Sorry I can't be more helpful right now, but, as I know you appreciate, I am up to my rear end in PIREPS.
Cheers Andrew
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Post by doggybag on Sept 4, 2011 9:08:57 GMT -5
Too late now guys, been in and gone...it's a one-way strip on my computer but only a 3k tailwind on arrival.
To be honest, I did try 3 times to use the active, but landed so far down the strip was unable to stop and went around again.
I did not file that pirep as I was almost 20 minutes late.
Andrew you devil, you have done it again...I look forward to your challenges every year.
Trev. GARSA 009
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Post by paulvdberg on Sept 4, 2011 16:40:25 GMT -5
Have y'all been to Malaga lately? Need a Harrier or Huey to get in there! (at least on my set-up) Had to land my Commando on the road above the airfield. No problem, I kind of like these strange surprises; keeps you alert. See screenies. cheers to all.
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Ed Burke
Member
Healthy living is fine, but it's having fun that keeps us going!
Posts: 433
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Post by Ed Burke on Sept 4, 2011 16:51:07 GMT -5
Just a clarification of a remark in a previous post, "now that Bill has abandoned FS" was a reference to Bill Gates. The other Bill is just resting I'm sure.
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Post by Bill Von Sennet on Sept 4, 2011 18:33:26 GMT -5
Yes the other Bill (me) is resting. I only flew one flight in August, the test flight for the South Ammerican Rally. I had hopes of being able to fly it, but just as I was recovering from a health issue that required me to keep my legas elevated, I have been diagnosed with a new condition with the same restrictions. Trouble is that while it may not be as life threatening as the first one, it may be a lifelong problem. But I am thinking of everyone flying the rally. Thanks for supporting Bluegrass and Andrew.
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Post by Allen Peterson on Sept 4, 2011 19:11:21 GMT -5
Well, here's my 2 cents worth. I started looking around the airports (I am running FSX with FScene), then installed the add-on mesh. After looking at SKLA and some other places I uninstalled the add-on mesh. I figured using FSX with FScene would be the lesser of two evils. So far, after leg #4 I'm happy. But I most certainly would be interested in hearing about correcting pits and plateaus. Without going to X-Plane
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Ed Burke
Member
Healthy living is fine, but it's having fun that keeps us going!
Posts: 433
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Post by Ed Burke on Sept 4, 2011 20:35:09 GMT -5
Good on you Bill, I do hope you can soon toss this latest problem and be able to sprint around again. Meantime you could fly an Ercoupe with your feet up, or even the 'autorudder' option, I won't tell on you, cheers mate!
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Post by Andrew Godden on Sept 4, 2011 21:13:13 GMT -5
Guys, I am using the FS Global 2010 X add-on mesh scenery and whilst Ocana (SKOC) and Malaga (SKLA) are difficult, they are possible, albeit, from one approach only - a lot like Lukla (VNLK) in Nepal, just without the slope on the runway, as seen in the picture. Edit: In FSX only, with add-on mesh scenery, Cali (SKCL) is in a total hole but the depth and runway length still make it possible.Setting up a light tailwind for the Rwy 01 approach to SKOC was deliberate and it would be interesting to know how many opted for that easier approach instead. Anyway, back to more PIREP processing for me. Cheers Andrew
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Post by Andrew Godden on Sept 5, 2011 9:18:39 GMT -5
Not one to let sleeping dogs lie and in my spare time between processing PIREPS, etc, etc, I have had a further look at the Cali (SKCL) issue.
To no surprise, not only can't MS improve the quality of the data from one version of MSFS to the next, in the case of SKCL it goes backward. In FS9, the airport elevation is correct, at 3159 ft +/- a foot or three. In FSX, it loses 735 ft, thus placing it in a hole with mesh scenery add-ons.
Ed, I have also had a quick look at using one of the programs to edit the airport data in FS9. After a quick 15 min session of "following my nose" I had created a scenery file positioning SKOC at it's correct geographical co-ordinates (and no quarry). However, it was only the runway surface and selecting SKOC in MSFS placed me at the quarry location with the control tower minus the runway surface.
So, on the right track, but I obviously need to spend more than 15 mins to fix it completely. Anyway, I have the tools, I just have to RTFM (read the "you know what" manual).
Cheers Andrew
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Ed Burke
Member
Healthy living is fine, but it's having fun that keeps us going!
Posts: 433
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Post by Ed Burke on Sept 5, 2011 15:40:05 GMT -5
Mush Drew, Mushhhh !
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Post by Andrew Godden on Sept 5, 2011 19:45:15 GMT -5
Onwards...onwards, I know Ed.
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Post by Chris Ross on Sept 5, 2011 20:17:54 GMT -5
Well I'm impressed I have trouble with Emails in Windows 7 They worked in XP "Mush" Hmm must be lunch time
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